Cross-border Tax Talks Podcast | THE PILLAR TWO ORIGIN STORY (PART 3) | Beth Bell

Doug McHoney (PwC’s International Tax Services Global Leader) is joined by Beth Bell, a principal in PwC’s Washington National Tax Services Policy group. Beth previously served as a senior advisor at the U.S. Treasury Department, tax counsel for the House Ways and Means Committee, and policy director and tax counsel in the U.S. Senate. Doug and Beth discuss contrasts between Senate personal offices and House committee roles; Ways and Means’ tax jurisdiction; and Beth’s experience moving from Congress to Treasury. Next, they jump into how DST disputes led to Pillar One and ultimately the emergence of Pillar Two; Build Back Better legislation; the Pillar Two model rules; U.S. credit design under Pillar Two; and the new administration’s response to Pillar Two. Timestamps and Descriptions 00:45 - Introduction: Prior roles in government and the Chicago Bears 03:50 -Senate vs House: personal office vs committee dynamics; coalition‑building. 06:20 - Ways and Means: tax jurisdiction and constitutional origination of revenue. 08:05 - Moving to Treasury: policy emphasis, foreign negotiations, interagency coordination. 10:20 - Treasury portfolio: Inclusive Framework work on Pillar Two; incentive treatment; transition pivot. 13:15 – Pillar Two origins: 2019 DST disputes, Pillar One focus. 17:00 - 2021 context: ARP momentum sets the stage for Build Back Better. 21:00 - BBB expectations: jurisdictional GILTI and higher rate assumptions 23:40 - BBB stalls: House passage vs Senate impasse 25:30 - Model rules land: UTPR (profit‑based) and QDMTT raise ordering/sovereignty questions. 29:30 - Credits debate: non‑refundable R&D pressure; political constraints 31:00 - Energy incentives: direct pay/transferable credits preserved via administrative guidance. 33:50 – Administration change: day‑one executive order; Section 891 referenced. 35:00 - Implementing the EO: translating political statements into negotiating guardrails. 39:30 - Section 899 emerges: House version sends shockwaves. 41:15 - Aftershocks: pauses, Senate dynamics, and relationships enabling removal. 45:50 - Cliffhanger: ‘side‑by‑side’ still pending as of December 16.